Debate contribution: Job Creation: DWP/DFC Collaboration

Debate contribution by Mr Gordon Lyons on 8 October 2024.

MLA

Mr Gordon Lyons

Party at the time

Democratic Unionist Party

Date

8 October 2024

Type

Debate contribution (made as a minister)

Business

Ministerial Statement

Heading

Job Creation: DWP/DFC Collaboration

Assembly identifier

Official Report component 4581962

Read the official Assembly record

Text

I wish to make a statement on the creation of additional jobs in Northern Ireland following an agreement to expand the services that the Department for Communities delivers in Great Britain on behalf of the Department for Work and Pensions. I am delighted to announce 1,000 new jobs that will bring a massive boost to the local economy. They are a testament to the quality of service being delivered by my Department. This is a vote of confidence by the UK Government in the Department for Communities. It is a vote of confidence in the quality of people whom we are all proud to represent. Most importantly, it is a vote of confidence in Northern Ireland from the UK Government. The jobs will expand the workforce, delivering vital roles in areas such as universal credit, child maintenance and disability and retirement services. As many in the Chamber will know, the economic impact of that job creation will be felt most by our local economies. There will be better footfall in town centres, busier cafes and shops and more people using our public transport services. Another successful outcome of this job announcement is that we will be able to fill underutilised office space. That will not only help with the sustainability and efficiency of our Northern Ireland Civil Service (NICS) assets but will allow us to hit the ground running on delivery without the need for significant upfront capital expenditure. I am committed to greater regional balance. Rather than just talk about it, I have ensured that my Department delivers. I have ensured that we spread as many of the jobs as possible throughout Northern Ireland, and I am pleased to announce that over 40% of them will be outside Belfast — in Londonderry, Ballykelly and Ballymena. In Belfast, there will be 595 additional jobs; in Londonderry, an additional 270; in Ballymena, 116; and in Ballykelly, 27. When I came into office, I made clear my priority of supporting the work that my Department delivers in helping people into employment. That is a primary duty, a fundamental principle in tackling poverty and a cornerstone for any functioning society, and I am pleased to play my part in supporting it with the creation of these quality jobs. Over 3,600 people in my Department are engaged in delivering services for the Department for Work and Pensions. That number will rise to 4,634 and represents an annual investment of £138 million. Those staff are making and will make an invaluable contribution daily, supporting citizens across the United Kingdom to access welfare, pensions and child maintenance services. My Department has a long-standing relationship with the Department for Work and Pensions, and I am pleased to announce the strengthening of that relationship with the creation of these jobs over the coming months. I place on record my thanks for the sterling work of my senior management team and all front-line staff, who have ensured that we are the best equipped to deliver the services. In what has been a challenging number of months, I am delighted to deliver some positive news to the Assembly with these additional jobs. This is an unrivalled opportunity to provide skills and jobs for people in all parts of Northern Ireland, and I commend the statement to the House.

First, I make the point that the jobs are being delivered by the Department for Communities on behalf of the Department for Work and Pensions. They are funded by the Department for Work and Pensions. The difficulty that we have had in Northern Ireland relates to budgetary issues. I do not think that I would have a problem filling the vacancies otherwise. It is not that the people are not there to fill the vacancies; they are not filled because we do not have the funding. This will be a separate funding stream from Westminster to deliver work on behalf of people elsewhere in the United Kingdom. I am aware of the issues that have previously been of concern to those who applied. A significant number of candidates were unsuccessful, having experienced video or sound issues during the pre-recorded interview process. I know that those issues were raised with the Finance Minister, who, obviously, has responsibility in that area. I hope that we will not have the same logistical challenges this time round and that these jobs will benefit people in all the parts of Northern Ireland that I mentioned.

I welcome the fact that the Member has acknowledged that these are significant job numbers, that they are not all in the one location and that they are in different parts of Northern Ireland. I accept that many other places in Northern Ireland have not received jobs, yet. I might get a few more questions on that this afternoon, and I might hear more constituencies mentioned. However, in this process, we needed to find locations where there was underutilised office space that was in close proximity to existing service centres and had the capacity to stand up to the operational capacity that we are talking about. I know that the people in Northern Ireland do a very good job, and I know that DWP is impressed with what we have been able to deliver so far. I hope that there will be opportunities for further expansion in the future, and I will do everything that I can to ensure that there are those sites available elsewhere. I hope that everyone in the Chamber will welcome this as a start.

I am grateful to the Member for her question, and for the fact that she also welcomes the announcement that has been made today. She is a dogged and determined representative for Fermanagh and South Tyrone, and I knew that she would ask a question on this. She will have heard the answer that I gave to the Chair of the Committee in relation to locations. She also asked about the future. Absolutely. I hope that we will secure further jobs and that some will be able to go to Fermanagh and South Tyrone. The most important issue will be to ensure that we have the capacity for the jobs to be able to go there. There is also a wider piece of work for us to do throughout the Northern Ireland Civil Service to make sure that there is a fair distribution of jobs. I will be more than happy to work with the Member and others to ensure that all areas of Northern Ireland can benefit from not just jobs in the Northern Ireland Civil Service that deliver for people in Northern Ireland but the provision of more and more services in Northern Ireland for people across the United Kingdom.

First of all, I could not possibly agree with her first comment in relation to the best of the Antrim constituencies, but we will leave that conversation for another day. I can confirm to the Member that there will be a mix of jobs: 70% will be permanent, and, because of the flexibility that is required, there will be some agency posts in there as well. I hope that the application process can start as soon as possible and we can get those jobs filled.

I am grateful to the Member for raising that issue. I was able to see at first-hand how the JobStart scheme has helped people to come into the Civil Service. Through that additional help and the work coaches that we were able to provide, we now have people working in the Civil Service who did not see it as a career option for them and thought that they would not have the ability or opportunity to do that. I am determined to ensure that we do everything that we can to make sure that people feel welcome to apply and that they have the help that they need to apply. The Member will be aware, as we have discussed this before, of my concern about the huge gap that exists in employment between those who are disabled and those who are not. We are working through that in the disability and work strategy. We will certainly do everything that we can, when the competition goes out, to ensure that people are aware of the jobs that are available and feel able to apply.

No.

I am grateful to the Member for his question. As he knows, 530 jobs exist there already, and that number will rise to 800. That will bring benefit to the economy. There are already people there bringing that benefit. Some additional capital work may be required to improve those sites. The money for that will come from DWP — there will not be any further cost to the Department — so there is some economic benefit in that regard. However, the greatest economic benefit will be the additional £30 million of salaries coming into the local economy. That will rise to around £150 million a year throughout Northern Ireland. That will be of significant benefit to his constituency, in particular, and we should all welcome that.

As I have said, we will have, roughly, a 70% permanent and 30% agency worker ratio, but those are exclusively in the DWP delivery. Some of the concerns that she and other Committee members raised were in relation to the wider DFC workforce that delivers in Northern Ireland for Northern Ireland. There will be a different figure for that. I know that some Members will not be happy that there are any agency workers at all, but a degree of flexibility is needed in the delivery of those services, which will, of course, be reviewed based on need. It would obviously be the preference to have more people in permanent roles, but that flexibility will be required.

As I have said already, we need to have flexibility, so there will be agency staff, but there will also be some part-time roles. That is simply because it is what some of the workers will want, so it is important that we have that flexibility. There will be a full competition process, and people will be able to choose what suits them best, whether that be a permanent or part-time position. It is also the case that some people appreciate the work that they can get through agencies, because that provides them with flexibility. I recognise the concerns that people have raised, however.

That is absolutely what we want to see. There was significant investment in that site, and we want to make sure that it is utilised. There are currently 284 DFC employees delivering services on behalf of DWP, and that number will rise to 311. That is welcome, but, of course, we want to see the decentralisation of jobs where that is possible, and I will certainly be advocating that around the Executive table.

Yes, there will always be the opportunity for people to progress, and Civil Service careers allow routes for progression. I do not have an exact breakdown of each grade, but the posts will create opportunities from administrative officer (AO) grade to grade 6, representing significant opportunities for people to get involved in the Civil Service.

The jobs will not affect vacancy rates in the Department for Communities, because staff will be delivering services that will be paid for by DWP on its behalf to people in Great Britain. There will therefore be no impact on the vacancy rates in my Department. It is not that DFC vacancy rates are affected by a lack of staff but rather they are affected by a lack of money to hire those staff.

Absolutely. For the record, I will do my best for all 18 constituencies in Northern Ireland. There is an important point to make here, however. This morning, I had a meeting with Andrew Western, the Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Transformation in the Department for Work and Pensions. He was very excited about coming here, because he had been told so many good things about Northern Ireland and its people. He told me that all he hears is that we are brilliant at those jobs. It is therefore very clear from officials and Ministers in the Department for Work and Pensions that Northern Ireland is the place to go in order to get staff who will do the jobs well. He said that DWP is really happy with the partnership. I hope that it is only the start and that we will get more jobs, and more jobs right across Northern Ireland, including in Strangford.

I hope that it is worthwhile working for the Civil Service. Many feel that way. It is certainly what my private office staff tell me, anyway.

It is important that we are as flexible as possible with our staff. Obviously, for training purposes in the beginning there might be a greater requirement, but these are hybrid roles as well and I recognise the flexibility that that brings, and we want to see that continuing.

I will make a special note for East Londonderry on my list. I am aware of the space that is available in County Hall. It is my understanding that there were a few difficulties with the layout, which meant that it was not possible this time around for the jobs that were available. I will certainly keep East Londonderry and Coleraine on the list for next time, and hopefully we will use that space. However, the Member, rightly, touches on the wider issue of making sure that we use the public-sector estate wisely. If there are other options and possibilities for other jobs in NICS, those should be pursued, and I am sure that the Member will do that.

I do not believe that any conversation took place with Invest NI. I believe that the primary factors for location were underutilised office space and sites with sufficient capacity close to existing service centres. However, the Member, like Deborah Erskine, has rightly raised the issue of those staff and the many talented people in that constituency. I will do all that I can, along with Executive colleagues, to make sure that we have those jobs available for people in the Member's constituency and throughout Northern Ireland.

The recruitment processes will commence over the coming months. A number of recruitment processes have been launched by the Northern Ireland Civil Service within the past year, including an AO competition on 19 August. That will support the recruitment requirements for this expansion.

Yes: absolutely, I can. The Member is a passionate representative for his constituency and, particularly, for dealing with deprivation. We know that one of the ways in which we can deal with deprivation and poverty is to get people into secure long-term employment. I want to ensure that those jobs and any others that come forward in Northern Ireland are available to all those who need them. I will certainly play my part in that. We will make sure that we do everything that we can so that people are aware of those jobs, are able to apply for them, and, where necessary, are given help or have reasonable adjustments made for them. The jobs in Belfast will be based at Great Northern Tower, Castle Court and Goodwood House. That will bring the number of jobs in Belfast from 2,556 to 3,151. Overall, that means that, in Northern Ireland, we will go from having 3,626 DWP jobs to having 4,634 jobs. Those numbers represent people from Northern Ireland in Northern Ireland delivering benefits and welfare to people in other parts of the United Kingdom. We are doing that because we are good at it. That is why I believe that we will have more employment in the future.

There will be, at a minimum, a five-year contract of commitment by DWP. It is worth noting, however, that we have been delivering services for DWP since 1993. That says something about the expertise and skills of the people whom we have here in Northern Ireland. I can assure the Member that, now that we have those jobs, we will not let them go. I will do everything that I can to ensure that they stay and that we get more; maybe even some for South Down.

You will have to give me a moment, Mr Deputy Speaker, because, in the decade that I have known Mr Gaston, I do not think that I have ever received a compliment from him.

Should we all just take a moment to acknowledge and cheer that? I am glad that he has recognised that it is good news and that it is good news for his constituency. Obviously, in this circumstance, where we are delivering jobs in Northern Ireland to provide a service for people in other parts of the United Kingdom, it will probably be a little difficult for people to travel from Burnley, London or Glasgow for the face-to-face time that the Member mentioned. The most important thing is that, when people need those services, they are as accessible as possible. Today, I visited people who are doing those jobs at the Great Northern Tower. They were talking directly to people on the phone, not just on a computer screen. Obviously, we want to get people online as much as possible, because it is cheaper, easier and quicker to deliver services in that way, but there will be telephone support as well. Certainly, when DFC is delivering additional help to people in Northern Ireland, we must make that as accessible as possible. That happens in jobs and benefits offices, but, for the specific jobs that we are discussing today, it not likely or possible that we will have the face-to-face contact that the Member described. We should, however, celebrate and welcome the fact that those jobs are coming to Northern Ireland.

2,972 words. Text as published by the Northern Ireland Assembly.

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