Debate contribution: Universal Credit: Remove the Two-child Limit

Debate contribution by Ms Kellie Armstrong on 16 April 2024.

MLA

Ms Kellie Armstrong

Party at the time

Alliance Party

Date

16 April 2024

Type

Debate contribution

Business

Opposition Business

Heading

Universal Credit: Remove the Two-child Limit

Assembly identifier

Official Report component 4483352

Read the official Assembly record

Text

Thank you, Principal Deputy Speaker. When you get to this stage of a debate, quite a lot of people have talked about stats and figures and the different things that you can talk about, so I will move on from that. Last week, the child element of universal credit increased to £3,455 per child for child 1 and child 2. What does that £3,455 pay for? It pays for their food. It pays for a child's clothes. It pays for part of the roof over their head, because we know that many people live in houses where their housing benefit does not cover the full rental costs. It pays for their extortionate school uniforms. If there is a school trip, it pays for that. It pays for so many things, so why do we say that child 1 and child 2 can have that but child 3, child 4 and child 5, as in Mr Butler's family, or child 6 or more cannot have that?

The Alliance Party absolutely agrees that the two-child limit is despicable and that it should be removed, but, as my colleague said, there are costs to the removal.

I grew up in a family very like Mr Butler's family. I had the added pleasure of a younger brother — I am the oldest — who had quite severe learning disabilities, and a younger sister. She would not have had any money. My brother's costs, because of the amount of disability that he had and the extra support that we, as a family, needed for him, would have meant that we were under pressure. We lived on benefits, and I had two parents who worked. Looking at this, I can say that to take away what support that there was for me and my brother, for any length of time, would have been unimaginable. Minister, we will support your amendment. We detest the two-child limit, but we are going to support the amendment because I want a better start larger families payment. I am on the Committee for Communities, and I will hold your feet to the fire on this. Can the Minister tell the House how much the IT system is going to cost and how long it will take to put that system in place to make this a reality? If we jump before Westminster removes the two-child limit, what will the implications be for the House? I do not say that lightly, because, if I could get rid of the two-child limit tomorrow, I would gladly do so, but, pragmatically, I do not want to take the money out of the mouths of children who are already in poverty in Northern Ireland, and which has been counted on by so many people.

Yes, I will.

This is Opposition day. There are lots of coulds and shoulds. I am not interested in coulds and shoulds. I want to make sure that people are not without money. Coulds and shoulds do not pay for somebody's school uniform or put food in a child's mouth. I need to absolutely know that, if we take a decision to do this before Westminster does it, we are not going to put people in a worse situation. I explained that when I spoke to the Cliff Edge Coalition, Action for Children and the British Association of Social Workers. I have spoken to everybody about this. Let us do this, but let us do it well; let us not put people in further poverty. That is why the Alliance Party is supporting the amendment. Asking the Communities Minister for:

"a plan before this Assembly to remove the two-child limit before the end of 2024"

is not enough for me. I want to see a payment coming forward. Just as my colleague has concerns that the amendment is a bit wishy-washy, so do I, but, to be honest, it gives a better direction, and it gives something on which I, as a member of the Communities Committee, can work with the Minister to take forward. A better start larger families payment by way of a Northern Ireland mitigation will mean that people here will not have to suffer from the loss of the £3,455 per child for the third child and subsequent children, but we need to know where that money is going to come from. If you divide £3,455 per child per year, that cost is £66·45 a week. Where are we going to get that money from? That money will need to come through as part of a coherent anti-poverty strategy in which all of the Executive have agreed to use the money to lift people out of poverty. I would back you on that, Minister, but I do not know whether the whole Executive would be willing to give up the money to allow it to happen. However, we need to do something. Having a better start larger families payment as a mitigation is what we need to do. That is what we said in the House about the bedroom tax. What a disaster that was, but we could not afford to walk away from the bedroom tax, so we mitigated the costs. That is what we need to do with the two-child limit. Until such times as Westminster changes that, we put a mitigation in place so that we protect children and lift them out of poverty. Sadly, I do not believe that a Labour Government are going to do that. I am concerned that £56 million is only the start of the annual costs for this. The IT costs and the length of time that it would take to implement would mean that we would have a generation of children here who would not have that support because Northern Ireland would not be able to afford it. Therefore, I agree with the amendment, but I say this to the Minister: we are looking at you for this, and we are looking for movement forward on it.

1,000 words. Text as published by the Northern Ireland Assembly.

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Assessed 21 October 2026 at 09:56 UTC by jev-1.13.0 (requested as typesafe/jev) under rubric 2026.10-r9, methodology 1.9.

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